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Q: Incidents such as the one in Meerwala and Mianwali
must be a source of frustration for you?
A: The incidents in Mianwali and Meerwala were not
frustrating but depressing. Unfortunately we have seen other similar
incidents over the past several years. Human rights activists cannot
afford to be frustrated. Regrettably, I have also witnessed the
exchange of women on account of murder disputes taking place in
the courts of Pakistan. It was only a few years ago that the Senate
refused to condemn the murder of women on the justification of preserving
'honour.'
Q: What is the legal status of the jirga and the
panchayat in the Punjab?
A: There is no legal status for the jirga or
panchayat in the Punjab. However, the authorities have never discouraged
this practice, thereby [virtually lending] this unofficial body
of self-styled judicial forums official patronage.
Q: What is the legal status of under-age marriage?
A: Under the Child Marriage Restraint Act, 1929,
marriages of women under the age of 16 are prohibited. A girl child
on attaining majority can also repudiate her child marriage. It
may be recalled that the Child Marriage Restraint Act was passed
by the Indian Legislature and Quaid-e-Azam supported the Bill with
the following words:
"I am not convinced that this Bill in any way militates against
the rule of civil laws applicable to marriages amongst Mussalman
I cannot believe that there can be a divine sanction for such evil
practices as are prevailing
we should not, for a single minute,
give our sanction to the continuance of these evil practices any
longer." [He termed child marriage a] "cruel, horrible,
disgraceful, inhuman practice, and went on to say:
[If] "my constituency is so backward as to disapprove
of a measure like this then I say, the clearest duty on my part
would be to say to my constituency, 'You had better ask somebody
else to represent you.' Because, after all, you must remember that
public opinion is not so fully developed in this country, and if
we are going to allow ourselves to be influenced by the public opinion
that can be created in the name of religion when we know that religion
has nothing whatever to do with the matter, I think we must have
the courage to say, 'No, we are not going to be frightened by that.'"
Q: Given the upcoming elections, do you foresee
any change in the status of women in Pakistan given that a significant
majority of the candidates have a feudal background?
A: Women are part of Pakistan's political process and
if the October elections open up the political atmosphere, women
will find greater space and better opportunities to raise their
voices for improving their status. Political mobilisation has its
own dynamics, which affect every section of society. The status
of women in the country has seen very little improvement, but there
has been remarkable improvement in a single sphere: the women of
Pakistan have acquired the zeal to fight for their rights and there
has been a sharp rise in awareness amongst them. Over the years,
women have been successful in taking advantage of positive changes.
They are better organised, more aware and able to strategise better.
It is my hope that there will be greater visibility of women in
every successive election which will compel the political forces
to heed the voices of women.
Q: Quite a significant portion of males appeared
apprehensive about the 'strange' ideas they maintained you conveyed
to the women of Abbakhel. How would you react to such individuals?
A: I am afraid that the freedom of women is
still considered a 'strange' idea among species that consider them
their own property. It is true that the women were encouraged to
see that a group of women from another city shared their grief and
understood their difficult position. More and more women are beginning
to speak the same language and share their experiences in a realistic
manner. The visit of human rights activists goes beyond token visits
of government officials. Our aim is not simply to report on an incident
or to seek justice for immediate victims, but also to identify the
root causes of such injustices. We make every effort to mobilise
women in every part of Pakistan and more particularly in vicinities
where a particular incident has shaken the people out of their stupor.
We were happy to see that almost every member of the Bar Associations
was outraged by the practice of 'wani' and a large number of ordinary
people want to see a way to finish this evil exchange of women.
Q: Are the recent incidents in Meerwala and Mianwali
reflective of a failure on the part of the government, judiciary
and civil administration alone, or are civil society and donor communities
equally responsible?
A: The incidents of Meerwala and Mianwali are reflective
of the collective failure of all sections of society - civil society
included. However, the state and its institutions have a greater
responsibility and far more impact on the lives of people than civil
society alone. For example, discriminatory laws are an instrument
of repression, which are legislated by the government. In my view,
the judiciary in Pakistan has done far more harm to the cause of
women than any other institution. If the police torture a woman
it is the judiciary that can bring these people to justice thereby
placing deterrents for further violence against women. In my experience
the judiciary, which unlike the police should be more progressive
and educated, is the last institution to shed general biases in
particular areas. There are individual judges who have played a
remarkable role in protecting the rights of women, but the record
of the judiciary as an institution has been dismal. For a whole
decade they justified the provisions of the Hudood Ordinances which
were clearly discriminatory against women. There are a large number
of laws which continue to be discriminatory but our judiciary has
struck down only a few policies which place unreasonable restrictions
on women. I can quote judgement upon judgement where judges have
sermonised about the morals of women. Some of these judgements are
almost comical, others absurd. 
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