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Interview “We are moving towards a Balkanisation of the Muslim states” -Prince El Hassan bin Talal of the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan By Samina Ibrahim
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Q: What is the significance of your current
trip to Pakistan as King Abdullah’s official emissary? A: It is basically to show our solidarity with Pakistan and to promote Muslim centrism. I met with religious leaders in Islamabad and I expressed my deep concern over two issues: the need to establish a dialogue between the Ahle Sunnah Jamaat and the Ahle Bai’t. I feel that unless and until a dialogue is established, it is clear that a plethora of fatwas will emerge in different parts of the Muslim world. Secondly, we always talk about the Muslim and the “other” and the Arab and the “other.” What about the Muslim and the other Muslim? The Arab and the other Arab? At a time when we see a deepening in tensions between Arab Muslims and non-Arab Muslims, particularly since the Iraq-Iran war and tensions between countries in west Asia and the Middle East, I think it is obvious that we are being fragmented into sectarian and ethnic divisions. And this will be exploited into a cantonisation of this region. The state itself is unravelling from within. It was for these concerns and to be briefed on the current crisis in Afghanistan and the situation in the subcontinent that I met General Musharraf. Q: Does this mean
that you are now resuming your political role in Jordan after a break of three
years? A: In terms of the trust and confidence that exists between the King and his uncle, that is a family issue and I will continue to develop that relationship whenever and wherever I can. I don’t offer advice gratuitously. But it seems very clear, particularly since September 11, that unless we develop a Hashemite rationale and a contribution to Muslim causes, we are not living up to our duty. I made it very clear that I am happy to pursue a role that I have already developed due to my international network of friends over the past three years. I am working towards forming a “Parliament of Cultures,” a centric Muslim platform, which has led to defending Muslim issues like Islamophobia and now Arabphobia. I think we have to think of pan-Islam again. Q: There seems to
be very little unity in the Muslim world.
Some Middle Eastern states are perceived as puppets of America, while
organisations like the OIC have proved to be largely ineffective, particularly
in conflict situations. A: There are 56 disparate countries in an organisation that was formed because of the burning of the Al-Aqsa mosque. But as with all reactions, unless they then focus… there was no concept of cooperation between 56 countries except in cases of crisis management. And even that we haven’t succeeded in doing. It’s perfectly obvious that the crises of countries from Morocco to Indonesia need detailed regional attention. We need to think globally and act locally. So far we have not been able to act locally or even regionally. The European troika represents three European countries on a six monthly cycle. At the last meeting of the Arab League three weeks ago, we recommended that they should consider regional representation. We have the Arab Mashriq and the Arab Maghreb as well as the Gulf countries and I think that if we look back to the days of the CENTO pact… we have the unthinkable situation today of Pakistan, Iran, Turkey, Iraq, Jordan working together. The accusation used to be that such alliances are western leaning. Today, ironically if you are not western leaning you are a terrorist. So we have to revisit, on our own terms, the concept of ECOSOC (UN Economic and Social Council). The Security Council, according to the recommendations of the UN task force, may soon be reorganised into three councils: political, social and economic. At that point to address the Security Council bilaterally ceases to make sense. Regional organisations are supposed to represent extra-territorial fields. Today one of the main themes being proposed is energy and water. Water will become a commodity on the World Trade Organisation so for neighbouring countries to claim they have regional or historic rights make no sense. We have to focus on anthro-politics rather than petro-politics, empowering the poor and dispossessed, human suffering and dignity; these are the issues that the OIC should be addressing. Q: How long do you
see the concept of the monarchy surviving, given the fact that the gap between
the rulers and their people is widening?
Osama bin Laden is a classic example of disillusionment with the system
of monarchy. A: We have seen the self-perpetuation of republics, from father to son, in the case of Syria; the continuation of Islamic republics in the context of Iran. As far as the monarchies in the region are concerned, particularly in the context of the current Palestinian crisis, the future of Iraq and the fact that the Islamist organisations seem to be upholding the pattern of the streets… the Islamists represent the grey economy and sadly many of their organisations are not above using sources of funds, that to me, are dubious. In that context, the very legitimacy, not only of the monarchy, but even the system of state, is being tested. I think this is the time, not just for monarchies but also for governance in the region to evolve and regain the streets. Over and above this you have today the securitisation of Islam, which means that the penetration of any grass roots initiatives is almost impossible. We are told by the west that we have no tradition of civil society, but actually the foundation of Zakat and other institutions should be allowed to develop transparently and work towards poverty alleviation. I have raised the question of Zakat at many Muslim forums. There is a lack of Muslim altruism, whether it involves a monarchy or a republic or any authoritarian rule. We have to make that shift from patronage to caring. I had hoped that our monarchies would evolve to the British and Scandinavian models where all institutions are working and I think it can be done providing the will exists. The basic requirement for a settled society is a state. Only the participation of people in building their institutions will move us Muslims from a culture of existing to a culture of involvement in real issues. Q:
There has been a deafening silence from the Muslim Ummah as the
Americans target “Islamic terrorists” both at home and abroad. It is the Muslims and the Arabs at the
receiving end. But there has been no
reaction from the Muslim Ummah. Does it even exist today? A: Well this question was asked publicly both in the Arab League and at the OIC. I think there has been a deliberate attempt, not least of all by the president of Syria to emphasise that resistance to occupation and jihad in the context of fighting an oppressive force, is an issue of deep concern to the Arabs. When you say Ummah, I get the impression that you are asking why your enthusiasm for Kashmir is not equivalent to our enthusiasm for Arab causes in Palestine. We have to realise that the agendas of sub-conflicts in our respective regions are now increasingly being governed by our relations with the superpowers. We are unfortunately moving towards a cantonisation, a Balkanisation of the Muslim states. Plurality is unfortunately not part of the lexicon of Arab nationalism. This is something I feel very strongly about. I do not believe in Arab nationalism that does not recognise plurality, I believe in Arabism. I think we are walking on the one side into a situation where it is convenient to penetrate the Muslims by using the schisms that are being created by our own acts. We seem to be entering into a new polarity, which has more to do with bringing down the established order. The extremists are calling for the destruction of all existing rulers and then developing a new caliph. But if that caliph is going to be cut from the same mould, does this mean that we will have more freedom and equality? Meanwhile those Arabs and Muslims living in the west ask why they cannot assume their rightful place in those societies. They ask us: whilst that you import billions of dollars of consumer goods from the west, why are you not promoting think tanks, chairs for studies, developing education etc? The Muslim has to cease both victimising and being a victim. If there is to be enlightenment there has to be a contribution from Muslims all over the world. Q:
Why has the Muslim Ummah not played a more pro-active role even in their
own areas of conflict? A: Because rulers are more concerned with holding onto their chairs. Essentially the whole Islamic discourse has not been focussed in a legitimate manner… let me be blunt… Mecca is a place for religion and prayer but it also is, and should be, a place for consultation. It is very important to revisit “the absolute fatwa.” This is not possible without a conversation between the four schools of Ahle Sunnah and the other schools. There is a bankruptcy of ideas and a will to change. Q: Palestine is going through its most severe crisis and Arafat has never been as isolated. What are the implications for peace in the region? A: We have focussed for so long on the question of Jerusalem, on the priorities of the Palestinian people, on supporting them. It is clear that people of Arafat’s generation want to go down in history as people who have fought for a cause not as a people who have accepted, compromise. The crisis may lead to a Palestinian cabal, it may lead to Hamas playing a political role. It is possible that the metamorphosis of Islamic organisations in the region may represent a new way. However what worries me is that there is no consultation over the interrelating issues: Afghanistan today, possibly Somalia and Sudan tomorrow, the future of oil in the context of the increasing poverty and disparity that exists around that oil. This is what I have been working on for the past three years since I was liberated from public office. So far we have seen no dialogue, there is a bankruptcy of ideas. We are only a region in name. This region needs a shared identity with other regions. We need to develop economic cooperation with those countries that lie in the zone of crisis, which are Muslim states. The Central Asian states are now part of a new energy super highway whereas the Middle Eastern countries have been excluded. There is something new developing. I personally think that the occupation forces in Palestine are being revisited after the virtual collapse of the Oslo accords. When I hear an Israeli minister saying we are only talking about 20 per cent of Palestine that we were promised by the Balfour Declaration and the other 80 per cent already exists in the Palestine state called Jordan, then I wonder at the validity of the peace process. I am also deeply concerned with the concept of the ethnic and sectarian break up of the region. The possibility of the emergence of Israel as the dominant minority in a fragmented mosaic of minorities is one reality, putting Israel on the borders of oil is another potential reality that we have to live with. Before we talk of a dialogue between civilisations we need a dialogue within ourselves. There are double values. Even in the case of the Muslims in Bosnia there were more statements from the Vatican than out of Muslim countries. There is a need for moral rearmament in the Muslim world. There is a need for citizens’ conferences. So far it has always been every country for itself. A strong Egypt, or a strong Iran, or a strong Saudi Arabia. This has to change. We need to be interdependent or intra- independent. Q:
Do you think the American presence in Afghanistan and Pakistan is a
precursor of American hegemony in the region? A: Well, the sands are shifting. There is a great concern about the American presence in the Gulf region and that presence can relocate in the broader region. There is already a massive American presence in terms of bilateral relations with countries in the region. I would like to think that whether it is Russia, China, America or Europe, the time has come for us to recognise that we have to share in building a new world order on our territory as well. The Muslims have to recognise their responsibilities to each other. Take the Declaration of Human Rights, it focuses on political and civil rights only, not on social, economic and cultural rights. We have the opportunity to cease being accused of hiding behind Asian values and redraw the Charter of Human Rights. I refer to a culture of compliance. What is required is that we and the Americans aspire to a culture of compliance to international mores. Q: You are working
towards a “Parliament of Cultures,” to promote cross-cultural peace and
dialogue. What do you hope to achieve
in the post-September 11 world scenario? A: The bankruptcy of ideas is not just limited to the Muslim world, it is also there in Europe which imagines that it needs up to a million migrants a year. Those migrants come with different coloured skin and different ethnic and religious backgrounds. And they come either as citizens living in sufferance or as integrated members of the community. If the latter is the choice, then clearly an understanding of their cultural identity is essential to enriching the community to which they contribute. What I had in mind was a plenary parliament… for example, the United States is planning on setting up a 500 million dollar satellite. Why do we have to listen to an American version of what is happening in our part of the world? If we can’t beat them we should join them. Why can’t we participate in developing a well-rounded interactive understanding of the need for a new educational programme for example, where the history, text and heritage of the “other” is taught. What is important is that this parliament will not be nominated by governments, it will be an independent foundation where there is a cross-section of civil society participating in a dialogue that people want to hear and that governments need to hear. As for crisis-avoidance, all my life I have heard of the dominos of Kosovo, Sarajevo etc., I have always wondered why the dominos had to fall. The whole region of the arc of crisis, which encompasses mainly Muslim countries, is bereft of a crisis-avoidance capability. We are not allowed to analyse the potential pitfalls. We have had commitments from independent sources to complete the study. The Turkish Foreign Policy Institute and the Bilkent University are interested. Istanbul is both a European and Asian city and in an ideal location to begin with. By the end of the year we should be finalising our plans, which should involve both the western hemisphere and the Middle East region. Q: How hopeful are
you of stability and understanding within the Muslim world? A: I think fear is a great wake-up
call for both the Muslim masses, as well as the Muslim rulers.
The time has to come when straight talking and honesty has
to shine through. I can’t see any other way out. Otherwise we have to accept that an all-pervasive
evil will destroy us all. We have to move out of this circle of
mistrust, indecision and apathy and draft our own future instead
of letting others draft it for us. |
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